The problem with D&D is that it’s fun to have a good, detailed, world, but it’s a lot of work to make a world interesting enough to play in, without building into it The Conflict which, once resolved, leaves you with nowhere to go.
We’re starting, yet again, down that path. Trying to name the world, name its parts. In our world, the moon is the white of snow and ice, not the white of lifeless stone. A dreaming goddess creates a city on the moon, which is spoken of only in legends by the earth-dwellers. Steam technology and magic coexist, if a bit uneasily.
Are there to be elves? It’s always hard to decide. They’re a cliche, but they’re a cliche because they’re fun to play with. We can rule out kender easily enough; too annoying. How many continents shall we have? Are there common fauna not native to our world? Can I get my spouse to let me put in the common Semnian ground-horse, finally?
It’s a good hobby. It’s like model railroading sometimes; the fun is mostly in the building.
This, it seems to me, is what “God’s image” is. We have spoken the light and the darkness into being, and it is good.
Date: 2003-11-13 23:45:21 -0600
Make the dreaming goddess look like Patti Smith on the cover of Horses. That would be a cool game.
Date: 2003-11-14 09:01:05 -0600
Oops. I meant the cover of Easter.
Date: 2003-11-14 09:01:44 -0600
Patti Smith is a skank.
Date: 2003-11-14 11:50:56 -0600
About the ground-horse:
Date: 2003-11-14 11:57:20 -0600
As for the goddess, the cover of Horses is oddly close to what I had in mind. Sort of like: “I’m incredibly fragile, so if you come near me I’ll EXECUTE EVERY LAST MOTHERFUCKIN ONE OF YOU. Thank you.” But Easter, no. Too sexy.
Date: 2003-11-14 16:37:25 -0600
But the cover of Horses is not very “dreamy.” PS is looking right at the camera; on Easter, she’s looking elsewhere (probably at the ground-horses off in the distance).
Date: 2003-11-14 22:06:44 -0600
True dat. But my idea for the goddess Mora (which predates this worldbuilding by two or three years) was mostly inspired by anime villains/spirits/gods. I liked the conflicting sense of fragility and menace. Patti on Easter looks like someone you might know, but on Horses she looks like someone you’d have to worship.
Although I’m biased, as I’ve always been utterly in love with that photo.
Date: 2003-11-15 10:36:59 -0600
You might want to check out the picture of Lauire Anderson on p. 78 of “Some Women”
A world where Laurie Anderson is a goddess. That’s pretty fucked up right there, dude.
Date: 2003-11-15 23:44:52 -0600
Most campaign worlds have much more of a sound, solid design and contain much kinder gods than that of the cold, murderous bastard that is the xian god.
Date: 2003-11-17 17:28:32 -0600
Goliath, man, that’s just rude. What exactly do you want Seebs to do about the chip on your shoulder?
Anyway, I never said Mora wasn’t a cold, murderous bastard. Just that she might look sort of like Patti Smith.
One of these days I must go look at every photo Mapplethorpe ever took of anyone. His portraits are gorgeous.
Date: 2003-11-17 18:32:17 -0600
“Goliath, man, that’s just rude.”
It was an observation. Nothing more, nothing less.
“What exactly do you want Seebs to do about the chip on your shoulder?”
Chip on my shoulder! LOL! That’s the understatement of the new millennium.
However, believe it or not, I am trying to get rid of my seething, burning hatred for xianity.
Date: 2003-11-18 13:47:55 -0600
However, believe it or not, I am trying to get rid of my seething, burning hatred for xianity.
Trying to get rid of it by telling everyone about it? Cuz you actually come off as pretty proud of your hatred. And calling somebody’s god a bastard is rude. You can’t get out of that by saying ‘just an observation’ – I could say ‘Goliath is an asshat’ and then claim to have simply observed it, but it would still be an insult, and it would look like I meant to start a fight.
My actual observation: Goliath is not an asshat, but has generalized his anger, such that he has some problems responding to discussions as presented, rather than arguing with straw men. I was the same way as a teenager. Seebs will patiently argue ad infinitum without getting mad, but I still tend to go pit bull on people.
Date: 2003-11-18 23:11:39 -0600
“And calling somebody’s god a bastard is rude.”
You–like many xians–seem to be unable to differentiate hatred of a belief from hatred of an individual. I HATE seebs’ beliefs. I do not hate seebs. See the difference?
“Goliath is not an asshat, but has generalized his anger, such that he has some problems responding to discussions as presented, rather than arguing with straw men.”
My arguments on this blog have gone unrefuted. In fact in any religious discussion, I have yet to see a single xian refute a single point brought up by a single atheist. Ever.
Date: 2003-11-19 14:46:18 -0600
Actually, Goliath, I’m not a Christian. But I don’t think it’s appropriate to hate anyone’s honestly held beliefs. And it’s certainly not appropriate to attack someone’s belief with insulting language. So you don’t hate Seebs, you’re just being nasty to him; this is better how exactly?
As for being refuted, actually, if you’d understood the terms under discussion, you were completely owned. But you seem to think ‘I don’t know what he means’ is synonymous with ‘I won’.
Which, interestingly, is a trait you have in common with the fringe fundamentalists you seem to assume represent Christianity.
Date: 2003-11-19 19:29:21 -0600
Seebs: Make Goliath a god in your world.
Goliath: Seething and burning feelings are easily treated with something like Xanax.
Jesse: You can borrow “Some Women” if you like.
Meatwad: Where’s my discovery?
Date: 2003-11-19 23:58:33 -0600
Xanax? No, it’s not tension I feel towards xianity, just hatred…and such hatred doesn’t surface nearly as often as it used to.
On the other hand, though, a Zantac 75 can make the difference between a sound night of sleep and an ulcerific night of staying awake.
PS Hmmm…a god in a D&D world…what would I be a god of? To you, seebs, I’d imagine I’d be a god of evil and hatred. Most xians think my alignment is Lawful Evil, when it’s really closer to Lawful Neutral with Good tendencies.
Date: 2003-11-20 00:06:29 -0600
“But I don’t think it’s appropriate to hate anyone’s honestly held beliefs. And it’s certainly not appropriate to attack someone’s belief with insulting language.”
Thankfully, you are not in control of what I do. Amazing…a non-xian who doesn’t see the difference between hating a belief and hating the person who holds said belief. I didn’t think such people existed.
Anyways, to make my self crystal clear, I still hate xianity. However, here is a partial list of xians whom I do not hate:
My graduate advisor
..for that matter, nearly all the faculty, lecturers, and graduate students in my department.
My extended family
My friends (those who are xian, anyways)
So, it then stands to reason that it is very possible to hate xianity without hating xians. Capiche?
“So you don’t hate Seebs, you’re just being nasty to him”
No, I am being nasty towards his belief (see above).
“As for being refuted, actually, if you’d understood the terms under discussion,”
As I said, I know more than I will ever need to know about faith. I spent 12 miserable years of my life as a xian.
“you were completely owned.”
You are welcome to show why this is true at your convenience. Until then, I’ll let the readers decide for themselves.
“But you seem to think ‘I don’t know what he means’ is synonymous with ‘I won’.”
…huh? Ummm…no. Where did you get that from?
Date: 2003-11-20 10:19:06 -0600
“So, it then stands to reason that it is very possible to hate xianity without hating xians. Capiche?”
Ummm … No capiche.
You obviously believe at least part of good ol’ fundamentalist christianity are wrong. Fine. So do I. So does seebs.
But does thinking some body of belief is wrong mean you must hate it? Of course not. Do you hate the phlogiston theory? Does the thought of the lumineferous (sp?) ether cause “seething, burning hatred?” Hating a belief in a vaccuum seems to be madness. A belief without believers is only a bit of fiction. Do you hate Sherlock Holmes or the gods of Olympus?
But, to take you at your word, you hate something. What could that be? As you admit, it is not all christians. As you do not appear delusional, it cannot be the belief.
Might I suggest your hatred is of one particular christian? A particular christian you know well; a christian whose inner motivations, fears, and follies are very familiar to you.
Your past self. The adolescent who believed all that stuff you reject now. That kid who was so afraid he might not have really been saved and was so afraid of hell. The kid who prayed for purity but jacked off anyway. The young man who only found acceptance in his church youth group.
Yeah, you know who I’m talking about. Now that you reject the beliefs you had, you reject the person you were. You are ashamed of the person you were. You hate the person you were.
Yet, you cannot escape that you were and ARE that person. He cannot be cut out of your soul. He must be forgiven and integrated into you. He was only a child! Of course he believed things you know now are wrong.
“Seething, burning hatred” is no way to go through life. I don’t ask you to believe in anything. Heck, I think most christian doctrine is bunk. Just deal with yourself.
Date: 2003-11-20 16:55:41 -0600
“But does thinking some body of belief is wrong mean you must hate it?”
No. When did I say this? You’re supposedly a lawyer. Isn’t it a part of your job to carefully read things? If so, then kindly read what I write and don’t put words into my mouth.
“As you do not appear delusional, it cannot be the belief.”
Oh, so now you’re accusing me of being delusional? How very nice of you. You know, there are atheists who claim that all xians are delusional for having their beliefs (and before you start the accusations, know that I am NOT one of those atheists). Your claim that one is delusional if one hates a belief is ridiculous, unfounded, and blatantly false, since I am a living, breathing counterexample.
“But, to take you at your word, you hate something. What could that be?”
I’ve told you several times: I hate xianity. Why are you having so much trouble comprehending that?
“Might I suggest your hatred is of one particular christian?”
Might I suggest that you’re not only laughably wrong, but that you look like an ass for making assumptions about someone that you don’t know a damn thing about?
”‘Seething, burning hatred’ is no way to go through life.”
For once, we agree. However, the fact that you’re acting like an asshole is not making it easy to let go of said hatred.
Date: 2003-11-20 18:42:30 -0600
“Your claim that one is delusional if one hates a belief is ridiculous, unfounded, and blatantly false, since I am a living, breathing counterexample.”
You are lying.
This discussion is over.
Date: 2003-11-20 19:20:53 -0600
“You are lying.”
Date: 2003-11-21 15:28:56 -0600
Lemme break in here for a second. Goliath, I wasn’t taking issue with any of the multitude of statements you’re throwing between us like a squid jetting ink. I was taking issue with your manners. Your manners suck. Even if everything you’ve said is completely true, correct, and virtuous, your manners suck. You were rude to my man. I raised my hackles and growled. Since he doesn’t actually need me to defend him, I’m done now.
Okay, boys, go to it. My money’s on the lawyer.
Date: 2003-11-21 15:36:51 -0600
“I was taking issue with your manners. Your manners suck.”
And I should care about you think about me because…….?
“Okay, boys, go to it. My money’s on the lawyer.”
No need to wager, since the lawyer has said that he’s done with this discussion.